Ryan Wilson: Is Jason Botterill The Right Man For The Job? Is Jason Botterill The Right Man For The Job?

Ryan Wilson: Is Jason Botterill The Right Man For The Job?
Is Jason Botterill The Right Man For The Job?
- Ryan_Wilson

I wanted Botterill for the sabres GM, so I guess if your keeping Bylsma then he is the right guy.

Big off season for the Pens

I think you have to look outside. You'd think with Mario's connections, he'd have a pretty good idea who is an "up and comer" for that position.

I think you have to look outside. You'd think with Mario's connections, he'd have a pretty good idea who is an "up and comer" for that position.
- madmike71

Wouldn't that speak to Botterill still being a candidate though? If Botterill was perceived as part of the problem he would have most likely been canned by now, no?

Does the draft being a little over a month away have something to do with why he is the interim GM?

Not exactly sure either way but I think they should've cleaned house when they fired Shero , if he wasn't part of the bad descisions why wasn't he more assertive and speak up ? Not sure we want a yes man in there , who is he going to look to to say yes to bad trades ? I don't think we can risk promoting him.

Not exactly sure either way but I think they should've cleaned house when they fired Shero , if he wasn't part of the bad descisions why wasn't he more assertive and speak up ? Not sure we want a yes man in there , who is he going to look to to say yes to bad trades ? I don't think we can risk promoting him.
- Bradlee3

Who says he didn't?

Wouldn't that speak to Botterill still being a candidate though? If Botterill was perceived as part of the problem he would have most likely been canned by now, no?
- Ryan_Wilson

It's either that or the proximity to the draft. I would imagine Botterill had significant involvement with shaping the current roster. If that's the case how does ownership not hold him accountable too?

Maybe Botterill was more of a numbers guy... who knows.

The more that comes out of the Shero firing, the more I think he knew it was his last year. He went from not signing multiyear deals for older guys, to tying 16 mill into 3 guys past 35. The brass seem relieved that he's gone.

No telling on Botterril. The Pens are playing this strategically and I'll assume Burkle is leading the way. It's definitely gonna be interesting.

Pat Brisson is the answer, Sid wants his puppet in there; so be it. Maybe he wont throw in the towel when he is unhappy, which is exactly what he did this year.
He was angry that Shero didn't give him the pieces to win and you cant really blame him.

Bylsma is next to have his head chopped off, and Barry Trotz will be brought in. He is not who I want, but I think ANYONE would get the job done at this point.

As you said Ryan, it all depends on if he is a Ray guy, meaning has the same tendencies. If he does, he isn't the answer here. Don't need to further complicate things by having the same mistakes done over again. I do what I can to get Benning. He is coming from an organization that is run very well; has a very competitive team that has little weakness absent Montreal, and has identified good young talent through the draft.

Pat Brisson is the answer, Sid wants his puppet in there; so be it. Maybe he wont throw in the towel when he is unhappy, which is exactly what he did this year.
He was angry that Shero didn't give him the pieces to win and you cant really blame him.

Bylsma is next to have his head chopped off, and Barry Trotz will be brought in. He is not who I want, but I think ANYONE would get the job done at this point.
- nbartley9

With the talent they can throw on the ice, you'd assume that, yes, "ANYONE" should be able to get the job done. I know it's not easy, but just 5 short years ago, this team was set up to be a mini-dynasty. It's actually quite alarming that the team hasn't at least MADE the Finals since then.

I know it won't happen and is extremely unpopular, but I think one of the "core" pieces whose name isn't Crosby should be moved.

Sorry for all of the CAPS and "".

I know that I am a very impatient person, but does it frustrate anyone else that all the news about moving the Pens out of the Disappointment Era has been Shero's second hand, Mike Babcock, Bylsma possibly staying for another year and Crosby's agent. I would like to start hearing some names that are actual possibilities and don't have close ties to this organization. Rossi posted had an article that brought up Marc Bergevin but to me thats just like saying Mike Babcock, and it was Rossi.

With the talent they can throw on the ice, you'd assume that, yes, "ANYONE" should be able to get the job done. I know it's not easy, but just 5 short years ago, this team was set up to be a mini-dynasty. It's actually quite alarming that the team hasn't at least MADE the Finals since then.

I know it won't happen and is extremely unpopular, but I think one of the "core" pieces whose name isn't Crosby should be moved.

Sorry for all of the CAPS and "".
- jmatchett383

While I see the reasoning behind it and I do ... I have brought it up numerous times, give me an example of a return that is very realistic to get done. We have seen the idea of STL giving Backes, Shattenkirk and another player on the roster as well as a pick. Do you think that move elevates STL, giving three major pieces from their roster? I don't. I think it would be counterproductive for them to do it. I don't think a team in the play-offs will give up three roster players, two being very significant and a high pick for one player. I think its retarded to deal him straight up to Nashville for Weber as some suggest. That doesn't solve a problem when you consider our lack of depth at forward.

If you can give me two examples ... I'm all ears

Thanks

With the talent they can throw on the ice, you'd assume that, yes, "ANYONE" should be able to get the job done. I know it's not easy, but just 5 short years ago, this team was set up to be a mini-dynasty. It's actually quite alarming that the team hasn't at least MADE the Finals since then.

I know it won't happen and is extremely unpopular, but I think one of the "core" pieces whose name isn't Crosby should be moved.
- jmatchett383

They tried to trade Letang and it didn't happen, Geno wont be going anywhere. MAF maybe, but I think that would be a mistake.

This team had the pieces last year, and they were used in the wrong way. This year we didn't have the pieces and they were used in the best way possible, (minus the Glass for Bennett move).

I have a feeling that Botterill was one of those guys who did his job and gave his best advice, but was sometimes ignored when the actual decisions were made by Ray. He may have a good eye for talent and an obvious acumen for crunching numbers to make cap situations work, but that doesn't mean that his advice was always heeded by those making the final decisions.

Is he a "yes man" if Ray would come to him and ask "how do we make this situation work with X, Y and Z player making these dollar amounts"? Or does that mean he's just a guy with a calculator? If he was regularly giving him the answers and also giving him alternatives with plays A, B and C instead, does that make him a yes man? I don't think so. I think he's just doing his job and not being the one that gets to make the final decisions on personnel moves until now.

Additionally, if he's just working with what he has because Ray and the rest of the scouting staff have not provided him with better tools, but has maximized the effectiveness of the assets he did have in his toolbox, then I don't think that makes him a "yes man" either. I think it makes him effective in working with less-than-ideal assets and maximizing the results.

I mean, he could have been asking for certain things but then worked with what he was given and produced pretty good results but not great results. But when n a position to make the decision on what kind of tools he puts in his toolbox, instead of being at the whim of someone above him, then maybe he is more effective.

But I don't think just being part of the Shero administration needs to disqualify him from the job.

A certain person seems to be dropping the ball on the gif postings here...

I have a feeling that Botterill was one of those guys who did his job and gave his best advice, but was sometimes ignored when the actual decisions were made by Ray. He may have a good eye for talent and an obvious acumen for crunching numbers to make cap situations work, but that doesn't mean that his advice was always heeded by those making the final decisions.

Is he a "yes man" if Ray would come to him and ask "how do we make this situation work with X, Y and Z player making these dollar amounts"? Or does that mean he's just a guy with a calculator? If he was regularly giving him the answers and also giving him alternatives with plays A, B and C instead, does that make him a yes man? I don't think so. I think he's just doing his job and not being the one that gets to make the final decisions on personnel moves until now.

Additionally, if he's just working with what he has because Ray and the rest of the scouting staff have not provided him with better tools, but has maximized the effectiveness of the assets he did have in his toolbox, then I don't think that makes him a "yes man" either. I think it makes him effective in working with less-than-ideal assets and maximizing the results.

I mean, he could have been asking for certain things but then worked with what he was given and produced pretty good results but not great results. But when n a position to make the decision on what kind of tools he puts in his toolbox, instead of being at the whim of someone above him, then maybe he is more effective.

But I don't think just being part of the Shero administration needs to disqualify him from the job.
- ScienceJesus

I don't think anyone is eliminating him from consideration because he was part of the Shero administration. They want to know what his tendencies would be as far as decisions. Do they mirror Ray's philosophies, or do they go against? Not saying all of Ray's tendencies were bad, but two or three of them got us in trouble. If those three tendencies are on Botterril's resume, then its an easy decision to me. I guess, where is the difference between the two. That is the question

Another great article, Ryan. I believe that the more important questions you are asking are somewhat rhetorical, in that we will never know the true answer until after the potential hiring (e.g. was Botterill a Shero "yes man" per se?). When it comes to the coach, I believe the same could be applied to Granato (was he a Bylsma "yes-man"?). Regardless, I think they have to have both positions filled ASAP, especially if Letang is or isn't going to be part of this team going forward. Sorry, no answers here only observations.

I don't think anyone is eliminating him from consideration because he was part of the Shero administration. They want to know what his tendencies would be as far as decisions. Do they mirror Ray's philosophies, or do they go against? Not saying all of Ray's tendencies were bad, but two or three of them got us in trouble. If those three tendencies are on Botterril's resume, then its an easy decision to me. I guess, where is the difference between the two. That is the question
- Oneonta Penguin

I'm with you there. And I think that, barring being inside the front office and being a fly on the wall, we'll never really know what kind of influence Botterill really had and on what decisions he was consulted or left out of. The only way to tell is to look at decisions on a case-by-case basis, grade the outcome of the decisions, and look at the influence or lack-thereof that Botterill had in that decision. That's never going to happen in the public eye.

Because the only issues I really had with Shero was the questionable drafting of smallish forwards with mediocre skill (which might be the result of his time behind Poile in Nashville) while focusing almost exclusively on defensemen (the stockpiling of which isn't necessarily a bad thing). And his seeming reluctance to sometimes tell Dan "look, I got you this guy & this guy for these reasons. Stop using them in these other roles they're not fit to play or else I'll find someone that WILL use the guys I gave you correctly".

I pass on anyone from the current regime to fill any role assistant coaches included. I also thought the Pens butchered this entire situation. I mean Moorehouse and Shero are on the same level in the business structure. That's like me firing another broker. Makes no sense. Burkle and Lemieux both gave contradicting statements about Bylsma. Certainly they wouldn't bash the guy and they both went out of their way to compliment him, however Burkle goes on to mention how they wish they would have made a change last year and Lemieux goes on to say how it was his idea to bring in another coach to help out. Doesn't sound like they were very confident in the guy. then they keep him around? It was such a pirates thing to do. They handled it poorly

I'm with you there. And I think that, barring being inside the front office and being a fly on the wall, we'll never really know what kind of influence Botterill really had and on what decisions he was consulted or left out of. The only way to tell is to look at decisions on a case-by-case basis, grade the outcome of the decisions, and look at the influence or lack-thereof that Botterill had in that decision. That's never going to happen in the public eye.

Because the only issues I really had with Shero was the questionable drafting of smallish forwards with mediocre skill (which might be the result of his time behind Poile in Nashville) while focusing almost exclusively on defensemen (the stockpiling of which isn't necessarily a bad thing). And his seeming reluctance to sometimes tell Dan "look, I got you this guy & this guy for these reasons. Stop using them in these other roles they're not fit to play or else I'll find someone that WILL use the guys I gave you correctly".
- ScienceJesus

JMO, the Neal/Niskanen deal for Gogo set this entire "collect PMDs" thing going. He saw how other GMs valued PMDs and he thought it you start collecting them, he could then trade them off to get the forwards needed. This is sort of the way how the Pirates failed for many years, always drafting pitching in the early rounds and neglecting bats, in hopes you can trade one of these arms down the road for a significant haul.

His drafting philosophies of neglecting one position really cost us. His entire "asset management" philosophy wasn't good if you really think about it. Joe Morrow, one of those high end PMD prospects you drafted, goes for an aging Brendan Morrow. Two second round picks for a slow Doug Murray, a guy that fell out of favor in SJ; wasn't being used and wasn't going to be resigned in SJ. That was a heavy price to pay.

This is why if you attempt to deal a Neal and or a Letang, its important to not only get a roster player back of significance, but a forward prospect as well. The farm system is devoid of talent at forward.

I pass on anyone from the current regime to fill any role assistant coaches included. I also thought the Pens butchered this entire situation. I mean Moorehouse and Shero are on the same level in the business structure. That's like me firing another broker. Makes no sense. Burkle and Lemieux both gave contradicting statements about Bylsma. Certainly they wouldn't bash the guy and they both went out of their way to compliment him, however Burkle goes on to mention how they wish they would have made a change last year and Lemieux goes on to say how it was his idea to bring in another coach to help out. Doesn't sound like they were very confident in the guy. then they keep him around? It was such a pirates thing to do. They handled it poorly
- dbell646

I still think it makes perfect sense. They don't want to get involved in hockey operations unless absolutely necessary. So they fired the GM instead. The GM is the furthest removed from being a directly hockey operations employee while still being involved in hockey operations and managing all the hockey operations people.

Plus, they get to bring in a new GM without any "ownership already decided that one for you" situations from day 1 to potentially sour candidates with concerns about ownership meddling. As much as Mario and Burkle like to avoid the camera and everyone talks about how hands-off they are, there's still GOT to be a worry for any potential candidate about working for a hockey guy like Mario and him getting involved in how a GM or Coach does their jobs. It's about the optics for potential GM candidates. Not the fans. At least for now.

Once the new GM is in place, then the focus gets turned to the fan optics. That's when whoever the GM ends up being gets to ingratiate himself to ownership and the fans by firing Dan and declaring a new direction for the team to create a new, winning atmosphere in Pittsburgh without being mired in the shadow of 2009. Fans tentatively give the new guys the benefit of the doubt and the ticket sales bleeding slows or stops for the time being.

That solves the immediate problems. The next job would be to actually fix the on-ice product and that's when we all wait & see how it turns out.

JMO, the Neal/Niskanen deal for Gogo set this entire "collect PMDs" thing going. He saw how other GMs valued PMDs and he thought it you start collecting them, he could then trade them off to get the forwards needed. This is sort of the way how the Pirates failed for many years, always drafting pitching in the early rounds and neglecting bats, in hopes you can trade one of these arms down the road for a significant haul.

His drafting philosophies of neglecting one position really cost us. His entire "asset management" philosophy wasn't good if you really think about it. Joe Morrow, one of those high end PMD prospects you drafted, goes for an aging Brendan Morrow. Two second round picks for a slow Doug Murray, a guy that fell out of favor in SJ; wasn't being used and wasn't going to be resigned in SJ. That was a heavy price to pay.

This is why if you attempt to deal a Neal and or a Letang, its important to not only get a roster player back of significance, but a forward prospect as well. The farm system is devoid of talent at forward.
- Oneonta Penguin

Agreed. You can't just try to dump Neal and Letang to create cap space, because you are going to overpay for whomever you have to get in terms of replacement value. Some trades are going to need to be made, but you do have valuable assets here and its important to get assets in return.

I have no idea what the qualifications are to be a GM. I look at people like Gillis, Holmgren, Mcphee, Feaster, and Milbury who all have done completely horrible at their jobs, yet are still in the industry. Managing a budget, scouting, player and coach evals, and establishing a plan, managing assets all really don't seem like complicated items. Other than Shero's dad being a HOF coach, what exactly were his quals? Apparanty there aren't too many ppl capable of doing the job since those clowns are still employed.